Factions / introductions and Vvardenfell links

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Rot
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Imperial Legion
Vanilla has you enlist at Gnisis Fort Darius specifically. This is very deliberate because the early questline there serves as an introduction to the faction, before the player who’s of course not going to be a trooper moves on to getting more Knight-type orders.
> Does the excuse (“all the other legions are at full capacity”) still hold for the whole province? Otherwise what?
Also, the advancement structure specifically leads the player to Castle Ebonheart by the end, where they’ll eventually join the Order of Ebonheart and advance to Knight of the Garland only after a certain quest; also reflected in that they’re given the Duke’s Guard armour in the usual fashion of “advancement gives Legion uniform” (the Duke, his guards and that purple cuirass are all specific to Ebonheart).
> How do potential Legion quests on the Mainland deal with rank and advancement? Different Orders for late quests perhaps?
Note that there’s also an unused “Imperial Knights” faction.

Morag Tong
Joinable in Vivec’s secret quarters by talking to Eno Hlaalu only. That should be kept IMO;
There are two groups of quests in the original MT: Eno Hlaalu’s writs, and writs that can be given by and turned in to any Master in any hall.
> Should the original Vvardenfell writs be available to Masters on the mainland?
There’s no particular excuse why they shouldn’t if going only by proximity, since TR has gotten rid of the quarantine. I’d favor leaving the generic vanilla contracts available on the mainland; these are not difficult quests to make and it wouldn’t be much work to add the chance of giving mainland contracts specifically for them too (with or without making them also available to vanilla masters – as these are only based on generic rank-conditioned dialogue, it wouldn’t generate conflicts).

Tribunal Temple
Vvardenfell puts you through the Pilgrimage of the Seven Graces before giving duties. TR does the same with any 3 (of currently five) pilgrimages anywhere before giving duties (duties available only in Ranyon-Ruhn so far). The current pilgrimages are obviously centered around the released regions.
> Will the pilgrimages-duties pattern be kept everywhere else and how? Necrom?
Also, the eventual plan is for the current “Mainland Tribunal Temple” version to be reverted to the original “Tribunal Temple”. For the purpose of the temporary patch I’ll keep to “duties on Vvardenfell only after Vvardenfell pilgrimages; duties on Mainland only after Mainland pilgrimages”, but something else may be figured out for the global plan.

Apologies for the catch-all topic, mostly prompted by the plans for Legion quests; see
Imperial Legion Quest Line
Watch-of-Fire plotline
Handbook: Imperial Legion (currently empty)
 

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Imperial legion clearly said, that this is onle Vvardenfell island organisation.

But if make both legion together, maybe just add some forts required to complete like in tes4 magic guild you need aproval from all guildhalls?

And as aftermath I had idda about PC rebuilding Fort Firemoth and make this his personal headquoters as legion leader?

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The Imperial Legion seems pretty definitive, one track from start to finish. Perhaps an Imperial Legion questline would be better gotten at through the Blades instead? You’re sent there to check up on various doings, get involved—and perhaps get some special accolades if you are also part of vanilla’s Imperial Legion. It would be a depart from the formula we’ve followed so far, but I think we should keep the vanilla advancement setup special to it, and somehow tacking on a similar order like Imperial Knights seems cheapening.

Morag Tong—I could see another chapter of them in Almalexia, similarly only joinable through one person. This suggestion a bit out there, but--Perhaps it can be explained that the two different gods influence the two orders a little differently, and that’s why the different advancement tracks for mainland vs. Vanilla? And then the endgame storyline for Morag Tong could deal with the third, very elusive crew of Morag Tong that were associated with Sotha Sil/Clockwork City.

Tribunal Temple – pilgrimmages specific to Almalexia and/or Sotha Sil, depending on the region? As the Seven Graces is pretty much all about Vivec, which makes sense, as Vvardenfell is his land. But it doesn’t make sense for the mainland. (And if I have to go through one more Seven Graes pilgrimmage...<twitch>)

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It’d be nice to have the mainland Temple pilgrimages mentioned in corresponding books explaining the significance of the shrines ala The Pilgrim’s Path if they aren't already. Also, three of the existing TR pilgrimages (and ALL of the vanilla ones, except for the final Ebony Mail quest) revolve around Vivec, so we really ought to give the other two Tribunes some love.

With the Morag Tong, I don’t see a problem with a guildhall on Inner Sea giving vanilla writs, but it might get a bit absurd if the player is being sent from Narsis or the Deshaan.

Kevaar

Morag Tong—I could see another chapter of them in Almalexia, similarly only joinable through one person. This suggestion a bit out there, but--Perhaps it can be explained that the two different gods influence the two orders a little differently, and that’s why the different advancement tracks for mainland vs. Vanilla? And then the endgame storyline for Morag Tong could deal with the third, very elusive crew of Morag Tong that were associated with Sotha Sil/Clockwork City.

Regardless of locale, I think the MT should really only be devoted to Vivec/Mephala; Almalexia and Sotha Sil don’t really fit with the image of the MT. In terms of mainland guildhall locations, I’d think most players would anticipate a major MT hideout in the Mephalan Vales (there’s the training camp in Verulas Pass but it’s a bit underwhelming). Putting a chapter in Almalexia might be a bit awkward considering the Dark Brotherhood presence, but then again the DB might have only come to the city with Helseth (in which case the DB/MT conflict would be the obvious plot to build a questline around).

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Actually more interesting what you guys and guys from Project Tamriel do with dark brotherhood

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Kevaar

The Imperial Legion seems pretty definitive, one track from start to finish.

I’ve overstated things – only joining (Darius) and the last two ranks (Ebonheart Castle) are on a railroad, everything inbetween follows the usual process for factions in MW: you can do anything at anytime between the three forts at Moonmoth/Balmora, Buckmoth/Ald-ruhn and Hawkmoth/Ebonheart. So mid-type Legion quests are not off the menu and can serve as alternative or complement to those intermediary orders (the player does have to complete almost all of them to reach the penultimate rank, and all of them to… brutally challenge the faction leader for the ending),

but yes if keeping strictly to the way things are, late-game Legion quests would be in the awkward position of being completely irrelevant to rank advancement and having to defer to the Vvardenfell-Ebonheart Order, which is of lower profile.
EDIT: that’s assuming of course that TR wants the “Imperial Legion” to eventually be a single faction too. Is that the case? They’re called “the Legions” after all… but although the player joins the “Deathshead Legion” that detail is promptly forgotten, PC then moves around all the Vvardenfell legions which are the same faction.
 

sirrah

MT should really only be devoted to Vivec/Mephala

Agree, though I’d like to know if there is a Temple stance on that, because they’re clearly more Mephala than Vivec. It’s just being handwaved so far

Biboran

what you guys and guys from Project Tamriel do with dark brotherhood

For TR, they’re the same as in vanilla and Tribunal – antagonists of the Morag Tong, apparently in a mysterious alliance with Dagon cultists. They may appear as random ennemies, or if non-Dunmer are being targeted for assassination somewhere.

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Imperial Legion – The way I see the whole situation is that Morrowind has no need for an up-and-rising Legion commander. They are too busy either filling their pockets or trying to fight corruption and the encroaching bad times. The only exception is Varus Vantinius, who got sent to Vvardenfell due to the political fallout of the failed quarantine. Everybody else has too much to lose, but he can gain a lot, with two artifacts and one dead upstart. So, I would recommend keeping it the way it is, with replacing him being the endgame.
Maybe place the actual legion higher-ups in Old Ebonheart (like it was planned), and have the player talk among them like equals? This would need some post-faction quest quests, but should add flavor to the idea that the player was the biggest fish in the TESIII pond, but with the TR the pond is now considerably larger. The player did eke out their own fiefdom in Vv, after all. That is my vote for “one legion”.

Morag Tong – Mephala is the anticipation of Vivec after all, so one chapter in Vivec is good, a guildhall in Almalexia under covert siege is plenty I think, and agree with sirrah on the whole. There is no temple stance on it afaik.

Temple – Good question! Ideally, the player would have to do only one pilgrimage, depending on where they start their temple career. Doing the other pilgrimages should be optional, but encouraged somehow. I don’t now how, though.

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Agree with Atrayonis about legion – as leader of legion on island, you can talk with leaders of other legion districs and make their quests to become legion leader of whole province

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The Temple could encourage doing all of the pilgrimages by saying that the PC will get better prices at the temple via a global disposition boost for the faction, or (harder to script) get (slightly) increased rewards from doing quests for the temple.

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“Here, if you go on this pilgrimmage you’ll get a discount” → Sounds like a Hlaalu. XD I would think they would stress more about gaining knowledge and enlightenment, or serving the Tribunal—something more religious as a motivation. In game terms, I don’t think there needs to be an extra motivation.

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FWIW one old plan for mainland pilgrimages was having them required before certain ranks – 3, 6, 9 and so on. That doesn’t work with the Vvardenfel and mainland factions being the same, but they could be required before accessing certain questlines/ “duties”.

I don’t like that in the current implementation a Vv Temple member is still asked to go 3 pilgrimages before accessing the first quest – the point of that long trek in vanilla was proving one’s faith, which in that case has already been done.

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I’m with Kevaar on this, it doesn’t need any extra motivation, and as Rot said you shouldn’t be forced to do another pilgrimage, if you already proved your faith.

However, and this would obviously need extra work, the player could be rewarded some sort of sigil-ring for doing all pilgrimages, which is something that you don’t get informed about ingame. The sigil-ring would be pretty worthless and more symbolic to the player. Now the catch;  a lot later in the quest series, it would open a special mission you could do for an old priest, who is convinced through the ring of your devotion to the Temple. After doing his mission you finally get the real reward; an artifact with a constant effect. Maybe 10pts Luck, 5pts Magicka, 5pts Endurance?

This would reward players who roleplay very devoted characters, completionists and curious players, while also serving as an eastereggy reward.

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Rot

EDIT: that’s assuming of course that TR wants the “Imperial Legion” to eventually be a single faction too. Is that the case? They’re called “the Legions” after all… but although the player joins the “Deathshead Legion” that detail is promptly forgotten, PC then moves around all the Vvardenfell legions which are the same faction.

This is an interesting detail that we wanted to use at P:C to structure the Legion questline: the player would progress from trooper in the Colovian home defense legion to an officer in a Nibenese legion suppressing Khajiiti rebels, and finally end up in the Imperial City’s honor legion.

One thing to keep in mind with faction questlines is that both mainland Morrowind and the other provinces are much bigger than Vvardenfell, and that it might be wise to structure the questlines around discrete geographical “superhubs” which themselves include multiple quest hubs. These minor hubs can be dealt with in any order, similar to the Vvardenfell ones, but the player would have to finish each overarching quest hub before progressing to the next one.

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Infragris

structure the questlines around discrete geographical “superhubs” which themselves include multiple quest hubs

Also a possibility for the Temple – Necrom would almost be a superhub in and of itself and is the closest thing to a Sotha Sil priesthood; the Vvardenfell player is basically a Vivecian priest, that would also cover the whole Redoran side of the mainland; Hlaalu and Ind lands = Almalexia; Dres have their heterodox branch of the Temple – but I don’t know how that would be put to use as a functional structure.
(and that also doesn’t help with the only Temple questline currently in the mod, in Telvanni lands)

A secret reward for all pilgrimages done sounds cool once you have a complete set,

Best now I think is to have them quietly give faction reputation (for advancement). That’s what the dialogue already says, incidentally. So they’d behave like parallel freeform quests. If the player hasn’t done the Seven Graces they’ll need to do 3 pilgrimages to access mainland Temple quests, otherwise they’ll still have incentive to do them.

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I'm over thirteen months late in replying to this thread, but I'd completely missed it until it was linked on Discord recently, so I'm taking up necromancy.

Imperial Legion:
-there should be joinable locations on the mainland
-I'm personally not convinced the Vvardenfell questline endgame should be our endgame; just that it should come very late in our questline
-we could consider having players tied to specific legions early on and then being let loose over the province later, eg. upon becoming a Knight Errant, which would fit, because, well, 'errant'.
-more specifically, we can probably keep the rough vanilla structure: 1. individual legion quests 2. completing quests for garrisons 3. storyline quests

In general, I'd tend to just work with the ranks we have. The more radical approach would be to reestablish the original split between the Imperial Knight faction (which still exists as a distinct albeit vestigal faction in the CS) and the Imperial Legion so that you have all the legion ranks + all the knight ranks.
But that would be a big mess that might require heavier edits to the vanilla questline, and in general, every other faction is able to make do with 10 ranks, so the Imperial Legion should be able to manage the same.
That said, I haven't had a proper look at P:C's approach to the Imperial Legion.

Morag Tong
-I agree Vivec should be the only join location
-I think we should continue the concept of normal writs being universal
-we will probably want to expand on more focused Eno Hlaalu-style writs as well, though, with new high-level Morag Tong questgivers

Tribunal Temple
-I think this one will require the most thought
-If we keep vanilla content as-is, it would probably make sense to have the Seven Graces be the Vivec pilgrimage and have alternate Alma and Sotha Sil pilgrimages, the player having to complete one of them.
-I'm not sure what role pilgrimages should have for the Tribunal Temple in general; wether they are effectively misc quests, required for advancement (not keen on this, I think most pilgrimages should be optional) or fulfill some other distinct purpose.