SHotN woes

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Glisp's picture
Glisp
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So I keep getting the following error with the new Tamriel data:

Matching IDs: T_Glb_Var_CollisionBox_02 Tamriel_Data.esm: type StaticShotN_TheReach_v1.1.esm: type Activator

I talked to Kaziem about the issue. She said to post it here. Judging by the above, the version of SHotN used to compile Tamriel data was a private version rather than the proper public release 1.1.  You can see mine and Kaziem’s discussion about it below:

<Glisp> Already posted it earlier today
<Kaziem1> In the bugtracker or the forums?
<Glisp> No in here lol
<Kaziem1> Ah
<Kaziem1> Right, that's the hope!
<Glisp> But I'm not sure if it's a real bug or a fuck up on my part
<Kaziem1> Well, we ought to know about it in either case, really.
<Glisp> I can't even load the game to start a new game lol
<Kaziem1> hmm
<Kaziem1> That sounds like a case of gonna have to reinstall it.
<Glisp> it crashes on the file initialization before the title screen
<Kaziem1> Is it okay if you uncheck the mods/unregister the bsas?
<Glisp> As far as I know the old BSA's are all unregistered
<Kaziem1> Also, did you patch shotn to rely on the new masterfiles?
<Glisp> I did it by hand
<Kaziem1> I mean with mash
<Glisp> Yes I did
<Kaziem1> so that it doesn't think it needs PT_data or whatever esm they used to have
<Kaziem1> huh
<Glisp> also tried the patcher that came with the last release
<Glisp> It's having a global conflict
<Glisp> If you'll notice above
<Kaziem1> I see
<Glisp> Which means that Tamriel Data may use a private version of SHotN that's been updated
<Kaziem1> That sounds like shotn isn't compatible with Tamriel_data until someone patches tamriel_data.
<Glisp> haven't tried Cyrodiil yet
<Glisp> of course that error closes the game making any other errors not display
<Kaziem1> That's interesting and important. Seriously-- please post this (feel free to copy/paste this chat) onto the forums.

worsas's picture
worsas
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Are you, by chance, loading a patched version of Skyrim_Data alongside Tamriel_Data? This error message says that in one of your plugin files T_Glb_Var_CollisionBox_02 is declared as a different object type. In our old data it used to be an activator, while it is a static in Tamriel_Data. In any case you should not load Skyrim_Data together with Tamriel_Data.

Make sure to uncheck Skyrim_Data in your load order and if it already is, it must mean that there is an object entry for it in ShotN_TheReach_v1.1.esm and you will have to clear the object entry of T_Glb_Var_CollisionBox_02 from ShotN_TheReach_v1.1.esm using TESAME.

By the way… the old Cyrodiil-release is completely incompatible with the newer data, even if patched. It has become incompatible with P:C’s internal data files a long time ago, long before this move to Tamriel_Data. All rock ids have been changed at some point in the past for example (it was before I had been managing data files). So the rock ids on the left side of the translation list are different ones from the ones in that old release file.

At the moment I can only discourage using our old release files. P:C and SHOTN are both fairly close to having a new release.

Glisp's picture
Glisp
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worsas

At the moment I can only discourage using our old release files. P:C and SHOTN are both fairly close to having a new release.

Nah I have skyrim_data disabled. Also you guys said there was a release coming that months ago but it never happened lol. I highly doubt it’s soon.

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<Kaziem> Any luck?
<Glisp> nable to find faction 'TR_FightersGuild' to restore PC data.
<Glisp> Unable to find faction 'TR_ImperialCult' to restore PC data.
<Glisp> Unable to find faction 'TR_Indoril' to restore PC data.
<Glisp> Unable to find faction 'TR_MagesGuild' to restore PC data.
<Glisp> Unable to find faction 'TR_Telvanni' to restore PC data.
<Glisp> Unable to find faction 'TR_Temple' to restore PC data.
<Glisp> This could be a problem
<Kaziem> Is that a MW error or a patcher error?
<Glisp> MW error
<Glisp> Seems like the person that made the patcher may have forgot to add the new ID's for the factions
<Glisp> to the patcher
<Glisp> This might be a little problem as well:
<Glisp> Unable to locate soul trapped creature 'TR_bonelord_greater'.
<Glisp> Unable to locate soul trapped creature 'TR_bonelord_plague'.
<Glisp> Unable to locate soul trapped creature 'TR_cr_muskfly'.
<Glisp> Also, anything that was killed produces errors too if the ID's were changed
<Glisp> for example: Unable to locate Killed Object 'TR_cr_muskfly'.
<Kaziem> Huh
<Kaziem> Okay, so this seems that for saved games, the patcher misses some things? But these things are not problems for new games or mods?
<Kaziem> (Can you post this on the forums too? This is really important. Also in that thread you started in cross-project coordination)

I was told to post this here by Kaziem. Basically, in a short sense it means that apparently whomever wrote the patcher forgot to account for a few things in savegames.  Not entirely their fault. I mean there’s a lot of stuff to keep track of so I’m not surprised. Namely, the things forgotten are related to Factions and creatures in soulgems. The other errors I’m getting are related to other things that are in SHotN and PC (which I have disabled currently so that’s no surprise tbh.)

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Kevaar
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Is this the savegames? Or does the same thing happen when you’re walking about in the world?

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worsas
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Glisp, can you possibly upload the savegame file you have those issues with. i have tested the filepatcher with creature-instances and killed creatures previously and had none of those problems.

The filepatcher currently only patches soulgem souls if the soulgem is placed in the gameworld. the patcher needs to look for soulgems in inventories too of course, which is an occurence I just haven’t caught in all my test runs and didn’t think of. I have had so stressful times that my brain was partly disfunctional and didn’t think of obvious things like these.

There is not really anywhere a reference on what data exists in savegames specificially, so I just missed out these occurences. if I could have your savegame file, I would be able to close these gaps in the filepatcher.

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Glisp
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sure thing. Want me to send you my other save games while I’m at it? The others haven’t been patched yet. I should note I use a LOT of mods in my main morrowind directory so I dunno if that will make things more difficult for you or not.

Kevaar

Is this the savegames? Or does the same thing happen when you’re walking about in the world?

Just the savegames as far as I know. Tried starting a new game and none of these errors occured.

Well actually I take that back there IS one error I got on a new game but I’m not sure if it’s the patcher or something I did:

Unable to find Region 'Mephalain Mountains Region' in Load for Cell 'Sailen'.

I’m well aware region names were changed. I think I may still have one mod with a compatibility issue.

 

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just the one savegame you have been trying would be sufficient. I just need to see where those records with the old object ids are, so I can address them in the next version of the filepatcher.

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Glisp
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https://www.mediafire.com/?5xxoqm5o5fpxudr

Here you go. Hope that helps.

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https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/22362022/TR_FilePatcher.jar

Would you be prepared to run this version of the filepatcher against an unpatched savegame of yours and see if it resolves the problems you had previously?

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Sure I’ll give it a try…...  Alright, it worked with one of my other saves but the one I sent you is now displaying the same error but using the new ID’s for the factions. The soulgems aren’t having problems now though. There don’t seem to be any implications for rejoining factions however.

Unable to find faction ''T_Mw_FightersGuild'' to restore PC data.
Unable to find faction ''T_Mw_ImperialCult'' to restore PC data.
Unable to find faction ''T_Mw_HouseIndoril'' to restore PC data.
Unable to find faction ''T_Mw_MagesGuild'' to restore PC data.
Unable to find faction ''T_Mw_HouseTelvanni'' to restore PC data.
Unable to find faction ''T_Mw_Temple'' to restore PC data

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I had been suspecting that the factions might be problematic still. I will come up with yet another version soon.

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worsas
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Can you re-download the patcher and try it once again?

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Nope. didn’t work.

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At the moment I’m more or less at a loss about this problem. I don’t see anything faulty about the patched savegame, but changing to the new TR_Mainland file with a savegame used in the previous version keeps causing issues.

One of the patched savegames won’t load at all, even though there are no error messages, it will just crash at the very end of loading.

With the other savegame, however, loading works and membership as such is retained, but the progress towards advancement is lost together with the problem of having everything and everyone doubled. I know about the problem and I wonder, if this is a general problem with savegames carried over from one version of the mod to the other and not necessarily a problem of the data change and the changed ids anymore.

Does anyone have experience with savegames carried between various landmass file versions?

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You see, this is why changing the ID’s was a bad idea. Project organization or not you should have just left them alone. What good is being organized if it breaks everything? Besides, with the default names we could still tell what file was from what mod. That’s what the suffixes were for. (E.G. TR_,PC_,SKY_)

Some people argue project organization and renaming the files was important. Not really.  Actually, a lot of the new ID’s are harder to remember than the original ones.  You guys see organization, I see “BLAHBLAH_CREATURE NAME”

The amount of mods you guys broke just by doing this is unreal. granted you can patch said mods, but that doesn’t mean there won’t be complications. I thought we agreed we wouldn’t invalidate existing thid party mods? Well we broke that agreement.  I’m probably gonna get flak for this post, but really it’s the honest truth. I’m probably not the only person that feels this way either. If I would have known this change was coming, I would have spoke up against it.

At any rate, fuck it. I’ll just rejoin the TR factions in my old saves. Will probably give me something else to do anyway. 

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You know, I have really spent months and endless weekends only on this naming scheme and also providing the tool to fix dependant mods to really allow people to adapt their mods to these changes. And every  feedback I got from people here and at PT was that the new object lists were, indeed, easier to navigate and more logical. If I get opposing feedback from a modder that actually does a certain quantum of  interior- and exterior-work around here, I’ll be more likely to take it actually serious.

But, I’m sorry to say,  your feedback on the naming system seems irrelevant on the actual matter of whether the ids are an improvement or not, only that I feel heavily mistreated after having done what I can to address your problems. I have never expected to run into a dead end with this and I’m really just as annoyed about it.

I’ve been hoping that there would be people that have previously transferred savegames between different  versions of  the mod, because I don’t see any remaining problems sourced in the changed ids. Everything in the ess-file is properly switched  for new ids, using the latest filepatcher from the above object list.

We have used this very same filepatcher to patch  our complete in-dev contents at SHOTN and P:C successfully and without the need of additional manual fixing. The same patcher was used to patch the mainland file, which has worked well in all respect except for those resulttext issues that we have recently fixed. This whole data move development has been going on for a full year and  right now, sorry, it’s just too late to speak up and say nay to it. There have been more than enough chances to do so in the recent months.

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I’m sorry. At the time I wrote this I was pretty frustrated so I was kinda venting. Hope you’ll forgive me for upsetting you.

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worsas
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I was actually anxious about looking at this thread once more, but I’m glad there was no reason to.

It’s a fact that I didn’t test the savegame patching sufficiently before the data move. I was successfully testing all kinds of things with saves, just nothing about factions and quest progress and that’s actually the thing people will want to save. Those quest-related issues have cost me some nerves in the recent days so I turned sensitive about it all. Thankyou for giving in, I guess.blush

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Here, virtual candy for everyone. Worsas, you did a great job. Glisp, finding weird bugs and reporting them is quite necessary. Thank you both.

Does: concepts, textures, youtube vids, admin stuff e.g. PR, handbook, assets, small website things. Activity level: wildly unpredictable. Still active. Find me on Discord.