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Claim: 4-9-Hla Claimed by Nemon
Maps In Group Map 4 at (-6:-4,-23) (-6,-24):(-1,-28) (0,-24:-27)
 Status: Approved, 100% Complete
 Faction: House Hlaalu
 Area size: 37
 Files:
Name Size Last Modified
TR_4-9-Hla_Nemon_3.esp 1.6 MB Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:46 am
TR_4-9-Hla_Haplo_1.esp 1.6 MB Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:46 am
Description
Hlaalu Territory. Contains a moderate settlement named Ald Erfoud in -4 -26 and a cave of bandits in -5 -24. Ashlands.

Also included in latest upload, 9 cells from east neighbor 4-25. Edited for transition into Ashlands.
Last Edited by Haplo
(Sat May 14, 2005 8:15 pm) Post
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Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



Unsurprisingly, Prometheus made Riverbridge oversized. It's larger than Ald'ruhn! This shouldn't really be very big at all.

In its remake I have an idea to make it classy. Rename it Shargon Mar (There isn't a river anywhere near this anyways) and make it only one cell. But build it on a large hill. One side of the hill is owned by House Redoran, the other House Hlaalu. Both own very little land, and want more ofcourse. They are connected by a tunnel under the large rocks which seperate the sides.

Imagine the quest possibilities of a city split betweenn two sides that hate eachother.

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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:18 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Vernon
Developer Emeritus
29 Sep 2004

Location: Sydney, Australia

Who is remaking it?
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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:27 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



No one, at the moment. I am calling for a remake while posting an idea of what it could be. The only thing I'd be really sad to see go would be the Temple. It's beautiful. Maybe it can be used in the Redoran section of "Shargon Mar" if my idea is used.
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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:32 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

I like screenshots of Riverbridge I have seen and think it would be a waste to rework this beautiful Prom's town (as long as FPS are reasonable of course).
The fact that Ald'Ruhn is the capital of the Redoran does not imply automatically it must be the biggest Redoran city. Think of Washington DC...

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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:43 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



Theo, Riverbridge is 4 cells. If it isn't mentioned in lore, it shouldn't be that big! Especially not when it's in the middle of nowhere! Narsis was pretty too, but it had an fps problem. This has a lore problem.
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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:44 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Dexter
Developer Emeritus
04 Jun 2004

Location: Baltimore, MD

...are you out of your mind? Hell no we aren't remaking Riverbridge.
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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:46 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

What about if Riverbridge was being built quite recently by Redoran as an attempt to move their capital from that damned Vvardenfell and resist marginalization of their house? Think of quest possibilities of this, town still under construction planned at the architects table and being built with the least possible rush with "hot needle", still not fully inhabited and placed intentionaly in middle of wastelands to usurpe the ground under the nose of envious Hlaalu.
It is quite desperate act, but for me Redoran was always quite desperate house.
Does it apologize its existence?

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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 11:01 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



Because they don't want to move from Vvardenfell? They just moved their council to Vvardenfell, why would they change again?
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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 11:04 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Ok, then they possibly don't want to move their council there but want to fortify their influence in this strategic area. And instead of building fortress they build a city.
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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 11:14 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
kingfish
Developer Emeritus
22 Nov 2003

Location: Prague, CZ

Dexter wrote:
...are you out of your mind? Hell no we aren't remaking Riverbridge.


damn right.

and how exactly this city is NOT in lore?
http://til.gamingsource.net/maps/arena_morrowind.shtml

it may be a good idea to stop BSing others' work just because YOU don't like it, sload lord...

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Post Wed Jun 08, 2005 11:37 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Thrignar Fraxix
Developer Emeritus
06 Dec 2004

Location: Silnim

This claim is undergoing a thorough review and might be majorly redone.
Post Fri Mar 21, 2008 11:15 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Haplo
Lead Developer
30 Aug 2003

Location: Celibacy

Yeah this claim sucks. See claim description.
Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 5:19 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Well, now I wouldn't object against remaking Riverbridge neither. It looked nice on the screens, but... Confused
Also Ouada Garidur looks well, but what is that supposed to be?

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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 8:37 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

Wait wait what? Riverbridge is the awesome of awesomes, and pretty much the sole thing (along with Ouada Garidur) that made me join this project.

I may be entirely wrong, having only seen the screens on the main page (and Theo seems to suggest there's a large difference), but I really think such a good city shouldn't be demolished without reason.

I do agree that the vertex shading should be killed with fire, but the city itself looks too good to have the same treatment. Ditto Ouada Garidur.

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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 10:41 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
theviking
Developer Emeritus
08 Jan 2007

Location: Alphen aan den Rijn, the Netherlands

It was me who discovered the cookie cuttering in Riverbridge. I also really like the city and it's layout. Now there are 31 interiors, if that could be turned to 23-25 while keeping the general 'feel' of the town I would really like it. The detailling and the vertex shading has to be redone, though.
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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 3:02 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Haplo
Lead Developer
30 Aug 2003

Location: Celibacy

Yeah the city looks kind of cool but it'll take some TLC to fix.
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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 4:42 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



Oh, and, River bridge is supposed to be on Map 3.

Built across the River Thirr.

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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 5:51 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Haplo
Lead Developer
30 Aug 2003

Location: Celibacy

It'll stay a map 4 claim, but if Riverbridge is kept as Riverbridge, it'll need to be added outside of this claim's jurisdiction. Otherwise we change the name of this town to something else and make it much smaller and add Riverbridge in an entirely different claim.
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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 6:12 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

There is a convenient river in this claim, and western adjacent claims for 'a Riverbridge' to be situated at.

I'd say that changing this town's name and creating a seperate Riverbridge elsewhere, or just discarding the name totally, is the best idea. But keep the general layout and coolness of this one, though, as much as possible, 'cos it is just such a damn nice place.

If major changes are gonna take place, could someone post up the current file here, so that I could DL a copy for the sake of nostalgia?

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a man builds a city
with
Banks and Cathedrals
a man melts the sand so he
can see the world outside


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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 6:24 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



you'd beter, this can't stay redoran.

But don't worry: the pretty parts you know and love will be used elsewhere.

and things aren't looking so hot for Ouada Garidur either.

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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 6:30 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

Not having access to anything other than the mainpage screenies, what's the issue with Ouada Garidur?
_________________
a man builds a city
with
Banks and Cathedrals
a man melts the sand so he
can see the world outside


"They destroyed Morrowind? Fiddlesticks! Now we're going to have to rebuild it again!"
Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 6:36 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Haplo
Lead Developer
30 Aug 2003

Location: Celibacy

You're a TR Modder, you have access to Map 4.
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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 6:41 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

This is true.

As a quester and NPCer I never really bothered to download further than Map 3.

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a man builds a city
with
Banks and Cathedrals
a man melts the sand so he
can see the world outside


"They destroyed Morrowind? Fiddlesticks! Now we're going to have to rebuild it again!"
Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 6:44 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



Bloodthirsty Crustacean wrote:
Not having access to anything other than the mainpage screenies, what's the issue with Ouada Garidur?


Its an illogical four cell stronghold structure in the middle of nowhere.

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Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 7:52 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

Ah, yeah. Having DLed Map 4, I can see that Ouada Gahridur is much, much worse than the awesome screenies give it credit for. The only part of it worth saving is the 'hut on the water', which could be recycled elsewhere. Otherwise its pretty crap, disappointingly.

As for Riverbridge, it is almost better than I imagined, but only in certain parts. If only exteriorers, when designing cities, kept the border lines on, then this would be (even in it's current state) just a two cell job.

Anyway, there's actually only one part of it worth maintaining exactly, which is awesome, but there's also a large part which is pure crap. For no real reason other than my own entertainment, and the hope people might agree, I've uploaded a shot with the good bit circled red, and the bad circled brown.

Now that I see it, you guys are right in that Riverbridge would actually be far better if it was cut down to a one (or technically two, due to the irritating 'cross cell nature' of where the designer plonked it) cell sized area, more concise and awesomely contained.

I like its 'arena' under the tents very much, but that's a feature that could just be recycled in any other Redoran city, but would be nice to keep here. Otherwise, though, the circled hill would do just nicely on it's own, and would be better for being smaller.



Riverbridge.JPG
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Riverbridge.JPG



_________________
a man builds a city
with
Banks and Cathedrals
a man melts the sand so he
can see the world outside


"They destroyed Morrowind? Fiddlesticks! Now we're going to have to rebuild it again!"
Post Sat Mar 22, 2008 8:19 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Zalzidrax
Developer
03 Dec 2003

Location: Bothell, WA

I will spruce this up and making the vertex coloring suck less and the settlement locations rock more.
Post Mon Mar 24, 2008 8:13 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Haplo
Lead Developer
30 Aug 2003

Location: Celibacy

I'll grant this, but know that there's a committee on what to do with Ouada Gahridur (which you should join, I guess), and what's going on with Riverbridge has yet to be officially decided at the moment as well. At the very least Riverbridge needs to be 20-25 buildings (preferably), but it's in the wrong spot, so it may be moved out of this claim altogether.

So basically... concerning cities, we don't really know anything yet :-P
Post Mon Mar 24, 2008 10:32 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



Bloodthirsty Crustacean, I can promise you that the temple on top of that hill will be relocated to Blacklight.
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Post Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:30 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Zalzidrax
Developer
03 Dec 2003

Location: Bothell, WA

Looking closer, Ouada Gahridur is not technically in the claim, but in an adjacent claim of its own, 4-29. Though I'll gladly renovate that, too.

As for riverbridge's location, it appears to be different on the Morrowind concept map than on the arena map and our own, which drew heavily from it. I'm not sure if moving it to map 3 though would be a good idea, since that's already mostly done and it would be crowding Dondril and Eagle watch, or whatever. It does seem like it needs a river to bridge though. Maybe add a smallish one? The valley that it's in seems like it could reasonably support it's own watershed; there's even a disconnected stream/pond deal in the claim to the South. Unfortunately, that's to the West of the road, along with the bulk of the valley, and for it to make sense to build a bridge across the road, the river that's bridged needs to be on the East side and get crossed as it bends West across the road. Alternately it could be moved to where, you know, the river actually is.

Oh, and Sload, dont' steal mah temple! Well actually, it would give me an excuse to keep the cool looking monstrosity of a building on the other side of the valley. I pity the fool who gets to make interior for that. Well, more likely I'll see if I can't figure out a way to make an interior floorplan for it with only a couple tweaks.

EDIT: Have an Ouada Gahridur plan



OuadaPlan.gif
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OuadaPlan.gif


Post Tue Mar 25, 2008 5:18 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



This really shouldn't have been opened for claiming in the first place, the reorganization of map 4's cities is an ongoing issue which has yet to be fully addressed.

Its very clear though: there will not be a Redoran city where Riverbridge is at present. I'm stealing your temple because you can't have it anymore.

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Post Tue Mar 25, 2008 5:26 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Zalzidrax
Developer
03 Dec 2003

Location: Bothell, WA

Technically speaking it's Prom's temple and either way one of us would be stealing it. Luckily it's got a nice flat base so it is pretty portable. And I certainly have no problem with making my own cool locales.

Anyway, as for the city placement, discussion only needs to be ongoing as people decide to make it. I would prefer to get to work sooner rather than later. Riverbridge is mentioned in two official maps, though they differ on its exact location, so we should include it. Out of the two equally valid general locales we have selected one and changing it would be inconvenient. Right now the problem is it's not near a river, and it's called Riverbridge (or the Dunmer equivalent, if we follow Bethesda's suit). So we put it near the river. Like this. It even will have a bridge.

The nearby Ouada Gahridur is an unknown quality and is too big for it's britches. So we distill it down to 2 cells and make it a Redoran Garrison - it's on the Hlaalu border, after all.

Unless there are any substantively better ideas at present, we might as well call it a plan.
Post Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:40 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gez
Developer Emeritus
22 Jul 2005



I'd agree that Riverbridge should be next to a bridge on a river. While there are some places that are ironically called, or sometimes the land around them changed (river made a new bed, for example), let's keep it simple and sane.
Post Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:00 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Thrignar Fraxix
Developer Emeritus
06 Dec 2004

Location: Silnim

why not move it to the map 4 side of the river Thirr that borders maps 3 and 4? Maybe if neccesary we could have the river briefly extend into map 4 by editing an empty part of the river on map 3.
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Post Tue Mar 25, 2008 3:43 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

Could we not do something like this: (see pic) ?

The Temple should go to Blacklight, which is a far niftier place for it to be, and a good decision, but that hill in general is pretty sexy. And it has a bridge. Razz

Even if it isn't called Riverbridge, and a city with that name is located elsewhere, that hill really is quite a looker. I think it's worth keeping, but then all of Map 4's so good that we have to make sacrifices somewhere. Sad



Riverbridge.JPG
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 Viewed:  168 Time(s)

Riverbridge.JPG



_________________
a man builds a city
with
Banks and Cathedrals
a man melts the sand so he
can see the world outside


"They destroyed Morrowind? Fiddlesticks! Now we're going to have to rebuild it again!"
Post Tue Mar 25, 2008 6:27 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Zalzidrax
Developer
03 Dec 2003

Location: Bothell, WA

Well that area is already well populated with Dondril and Eagle watch nearby and a village already on the Western shores. This area, on the other hand, could stand some more settlement. So, given the choice, it seems better and more convenient to keep it here.
Post Tue Mar 25, 2008 6:30 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Haplo
Lead Developer
30 Aug 2003

Location: Celibacy

Hey, we've decided. Riverbridge is being moved outside of this claim, to the River Thirr (Map 3). Probably the southwestern most claim, but the important part is it's no longer in this claim.
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Post Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:47 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



I feel bad for stripping your claim of what I imagine was the reason you wanted it, Zalz.

What would you like to put here?

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Post Thu Apr 10, 2008 7:39 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Zalzidrax
Developer
03 Dec 2003

Location: Bothell, WA

It still makes sense to have some sort of town or settlement, considering the area. I think the valley should probably be a bit more arid in places, but with more farms. I think I might keep the same idea for the settlement, only tone it down to village size rather than town size, and put it on that bend in the river, and then have a couple farmhouses/plantations to the south.

A claim this size needs at least one other notable point of interest, though. A monastery maybe? Of course I did make one in the claim not too far North of here so maybe not. Then again that was Hlaalu territory and this is Redoran, so maybe they could have a separate one. Perhaps the monks could be on good terms with each other, but be rather frustrated by the house politics between the two. Could make for some interesting quests/backstory. I'll try to come with some more ideas, though.
Post Sat Apr 12, 2008 3:41 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



Do you realize that Riverbridge was removed because this is no longer Redoran territory? I just want that to be clear, this is Hlaalu land.

And yes, that means that fort you made has to go, or at least be moved. It'll prolly end up on the Kartuhr-Stonefalls road, it's a pretty good idea for the Redoran to have a definitive border fort, what with the Hlaalu having stolen a good third of their land already.

What about an Imperial settlement? They don't have anything on Map 4.

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Post Sat Apr 12, 2008 4:14 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
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