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Claim: 4-21-Hla Claimed by Tyrion
Maps In Group Map 4 at (-4,-22):(-2,-22):(-3:-2,-23)
 Status: Approved, 100% Complete
 Faction: House Hlaalu
 Area size: 5
 Files:
Name Size Last Modified
TR_4-21-Hla_Haplo_1.esp 197.4 KB Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:46 am
TR_4-21-Hla_Tyrion_1.esp 197.3 KB Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:46 am
Description
This claim must be updated to Hlaalu, then fixed with ashlandificated borders to match 4-9 (I suggest some unscale-able hills).

Remove any trace of those Redoran hillbillies and add some awesome Hlaalu instead.

The claim is only five cells, but they should rock.
Last Edited by Haplo
(Sat May 14, 2005 8:15 pm) Post
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Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Should this stay Redoran? At least it needs some transition into ashlands (south in 4-9) and generally a lot of extra detailing. It's kind of repetitive.
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Post Sat Jan 02, 2010 11:00 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Haplo
Lead Developer
30 Aug 2003

Location: Celibacy

lol... uh yeah it should be kinda redone. It uses one mesh over and over again across 5 cells. And it should also be changed to Hlaalu; there's nothing here except flatlands, there's no reason why the Hlaalu wouldn't have conquered three Redoran huts, which need to be removed a la http://tamriel-rebuilt.org/old_forum/viewtopic.php?p=282537 anyway.
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Post Sat Jan 02, 2010 11:08 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

This claim must be updated to Hlaalu, then fixed with ashlandificated borders to match 4-9 (I suggest some unscalable hills). Check armun borders:

http://img696.imageshack.us/i/armun.jpg/

Remove any trace of those Redoran hillbillies and add some awesome Hlaalu instead.

The claim is only five cells, but they should rock.
Post Sat Jan 02, 2010 11:21 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

So should I claim it now? Does it mean I have to match borders to 4-9 only and the remaining borders will be matched to this? Also what awesome Hlaalu should be added? Farm, mine, village, small town, outpost, fortress?
Post Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:16 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Theo wrote:
So should I claim it now? Does it mean I have to match borders to 4-9 only and the remaining borders will be matched to this? Also what awesome Hlaalu should be added? Farm, mine, village, small town, outpost, fortress?


Hehe, nothing over the hill please. A house/farm that is Hlaalu would suffice. Concerning matching borders just make sure the transition to ash makes sense. The northern claim will maybe stay the same (although the river will be removed), so landscape wise it could remain the same.

Oh, and GRANT!
Post Sat Jan 09, 2010 1:35 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

I see. I will put there hilly belt (in ashland textures) separating seamlessly the ashlands area from WG and GL in the north.
These hills have been formed by hot mud stearing out of the ground and there are still some active mudpools with steam coming out. The path from Ald Erfoud will connect to the redoran fortress (?) in 4-20 but will have to come up and down those hills and past the mudpools through shaky ropebridges.
There will be one hlaalu wayrest inn near the road and a shack of somebody harvesting the mud and making fertilizer and medicine a bit off the road. In the easter part there might be quite remote cave, bandit camp or abandoned mine, perhaps lesser dwemer ruin used also for processing of the mud - you name it. I will completely ignore eastern border with 4-25 seeing how this area needs to be redone.

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Post Sat Jan 09, 2010 3:30 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Sounds nice, and if you post a few WIP screens after doing the initial rough work we'll be able to avoid any misunderstandings along the way.
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Post Sat Jan 09, 2010 4:51 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

So this is the most basic layout...



Ok, here are my suggestions. Seeing how this claim is a tiny piece of land sandwiched between 3 different regions I decided that to make it look natural some minor changes will have to be done to the neighbouring claims as well. These include minor alterations of terrain at the edges in both 4-20 to the north and 4-9 to the south (perhaps only moving the road a bit west is worth mentioning). However the biggest change had to be done to the cell where the river starts, which was originally in 4-20. There would have to be three different textures in one cell, with road passing through it and half of the cell being occupied by water. Very unnatural looking, so I had to change this as well and separate it with yet another hill.
So I suggest cutting this cell out from 4-20 (already did, I have the newest 4-20 file now) and merging it to 4-21. Then whoever details 4-20 can merge this file into his one or work with one cell less. The other changes do only minor alterations to neighbouring cells (no objects removed) and can therefore be merged with them without problems.
On the contrary I will leave eastern part of the claim intentionally undetailed and without objects, so that maker of 4-25 could do the same to my claim without having to cut the cells out. I hope nobody objects to this liberty I took, I can take it back, but it would give only hard time to one who is going to detail 4-20.

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Post Sun Jan 10, 2010 10:50 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

Just a reminder that the river needs to go. I have no opinion on the other exteriory stuff, but it all sounds sensible to me.
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Post Sun Jan 10, 2010 11:18 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Whether the river stays or goes is quite irrelevant to my future work on 4-21.
I did only necessary changes to the cell (adding the hill and road) and can just merge it back to 4-20 file and the person to detail it can start where I ended (removing the river or not).

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Post Sun Jan 10, 2010 11:32 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Sload
Developer Emeritus
06 Feb 2005



The inn should be in the grazelands region, which probably means you should move the border southward. Living in the ash is serious business, if you're going to build on the edge of it, you're gonna build on the green side.

Go with anything you want except Daedric for your other int I think.

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Post Sun Jan 10, 2010 12:44 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Nice overview, and yes the cramped regions make this a challenge Smile . The minor alterations to 4-20 and 4-9 should be easy to complete when merging. Concerning 4-45, I already did the nine cells directly east of my 4-9 claim, creating a nice transition into ashlands, so I guess I'll be cleaning up the rest of it after your claim and after we sort out the River Thirr region.

Edit: and listen to Sload, the ash vs graze is obvious when you come to think of it Smile .

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Post Sun Jan 10, 2010 12:49 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Hello Theo, any new awesome dwemer satellite images to show Smile ?
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Post Sat Jan 16, 2010 3:07 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Here are some new images of the claim. Normally I would finish this over weekend, but I am often not at my computer and I study for final PhD exam in March so I am quite busy. But there is some slow progress.






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THEO
Post Sat Jan 23, 2010 4:32 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Thrignar Fraxix
Developer Emeritus
06 Dec 2004

Location: Silnim

that doorway in the third image, do we have a respective interior piece for it? I don't seem to recall there being one.
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Post Sat Jan 23, 2010 8:46 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nomadic1
Developer Emeritus
15 May 2004

Location: Adelaide, Australia

If there isn't, all the interior modder needs to do is use the exterior piece on the inside.
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Post Sat Jan 23, 2010 8:59 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

I hope that it is OK that I use RM rocks for more mountaineous effect. Also what do you think about the idea of the great ashmire and the dwemer refinery built upon it (pic 3.) I would also like an advice what to use to cover the texture seem near the road (?) at pic 2. I used rock stumps and now log, but nothing just looks right there. (The provisional name of the inn is "Hollow treestump wayrest inn".)

EDIT: Now there is a cornerstone with roadmarker signed "Armun Ashlands". There are offerings on the cornerstone for those who have been burried by ash during ashstorms and whose bodies were never found. The innkeeper can explain this to the player.

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Post Sun Jan 24, 2010 9:38 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Theo wrote:
I hope that it is OK that I use RM rocks for more mountaineous effect. Also what do you think about the idea of the great ashmire and the dwemer refinery built upon it (pic 3.) I would also like an advice what to use to cover the texture seem near the road (?) at pic 2. I used rock stumps and now log, but nothing just looks right there. (The provisional name of the inn is "Hollow treestump wayrest inn".)

EDIT: Now there is a cornerstone with roadmarker signed "Armun Ashlands". There are offerings on the cornerstone for those who have been burried by ash during ashstorms and whose bodies were never found. The innkeeper can explain this to the player.


Yes, do use RM rocks as featured in the armun ashlands claims done so far. You should definitely download the merged AA file for inspiration.

Concerning the texture seem near the inn. I'd suggest pulling the ashlands into the canyon going up and right on your picture, adding large RM rocks to the base of the canyon and creating the transition into ashlands when the road elevation stops.

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Post Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:45 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Claim updated. Please check the file.
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Post Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:57 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Um, are you sure you uploaded the correct file?? It's way less than what's in your screens...
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Post Sun Feb 14, 2010 7:55 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

my bad Sad I can upload the correct file next week, when I am back home. By that time I will already try to have it finished.
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Post Sun Feb 14, 2010 8:01 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Thrignar Fraxix
Developer Emeritus
06 Dec 2004

Location: Silnim

Roth Roryn Region is coming to a claim belonging to you!

First off, here is the border region border. North is RR, south is armun.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b94/ThrignarFraxix/4-21Lined.jpg

You know the details of both regions and you don't have any roads, so all I can say is happy modding.

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The just man frowns, but never sneers. We can understand anger, but not malevolence - Victor Hugo, Les Miserables

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Post Fri Feb 19, 2010 7:04 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Well, basically I just need to switch GL grass textures to WG grass textures and WG rock texture to GL rock texture, right? Most of the claim is ashlands anyway...
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Post Fri Feb 19, 2010 2:56 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Yeah I think that would suffice actually. Also check the flora usage in grazelands region...
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Post Fri Feb 19, 2010 6:43 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

Theo, I can't tell from your pictures, but just reminding you that that line border TF just provided isn't quite correct. Make sure that your eastern claim border lines up its mountains with 4-25. (See this picture) Perhaps a small valley in between, because 4-25 looks like it levels off, though it looks like you may already be doing this.

To that effect, it's worth noting that, keeping the border with 4-49 intact as it is, the northern border of the Ashlands should be mountainous RM/MA (check Nemon's 4-46 and 4-24 for the perfect examples), not hilly Ashlands, pierced by narrow choke-point paths where roads are necessary (so like what you've got with your Hlaalu Inn, but heading through taller mountains, not with 'ashy sand dunes' on either side).

Behind this border will be the Roth Roryn stuff. (So there's more of that on the east side than you may have been expecting).

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Post Mon Mar 01, 2010 4:13 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Sure. I was not sure whether 4-25 has been finalised or not, so I left the eastern border intact. Now I will match with 4-20 to the west as well.

Making the hills in RM and MA makes it way easier to me as I will not have to use so much clutter and can make the terrain more mountaineous (it is really impossible to make anything but ashy sand dunes with AL).

The conversion should not take much time.

I also apologize for slow work rate, but I am really busy. I will try to finish this claim on sunday, but quality is more important then quantity to me and seeing there is no rush with this claim I can afford to progress more slowly.

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Post Wed Mar 03, 2010 1:04 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

Cool, and no worries.

I was thinking that actually perhaps the majority of this claim could become border mountains, so that there could be a nice steep climb up into the hills from the 'inn entrance' which then winds down the mountains to hit the ashlands proper in the southern claims (or actually the western claim, because 4-49 has the road, doesn't it?). For me one of my favourite things about Nemon's 4-46 claim is the climb up into the hills and then down into the Ashlands. Really helps the region feel like a defined space. Don't know what you think about that. Anyway, I'm sure you'll make it look great, whatever the case.

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a man melts the sand so he
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"They destroyed Morrowind? Fiddlesticks! Now we're going to have to rebuild it again!"
Post Wed Mar 03, 2010 1:31 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Actually looking at 4-49 and 4-25 the border mountains are WG. Perhaps the mouintains in 4-21 should also be WG.
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Post Sat Mar 06, 2010 12:25 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

4-49's should now be RM/MA. The WG elements are unique to the area of the iron mine.

On 4-45, that's true, but the RM/MA border looks a lot better. Perhaps begin to make yours a tad WG to the eastern end to blend with 45, or maybe we could even do a search and replace on 45 with RM rocks.

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a man builds a city
with
Banks and Cathedrals
a man melts the sand so he
can see the world outside


"They destroyed Morrowind? Fiddlesticks! Now we're going to have to rebuild it again!"
Post Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:07 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Ok i will do it RM and MA and leave final touches to Nemon.
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Last edited by Theo on Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:53 pm; edited 3 times in total
Post Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:45 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Bloodthirsty Crustacean wrote:
4-49's should now be RM/MA. The WG elements are unique to the area of the iron mine.

On 4-45, that's true, but the RM/MA border looks a lot better. Perhaps begin to make yours a tad WG to the eastern end to blend with 45, or maybe we could even do a search and replace on 45 with RM rocks.


I think you are mixing 4-45 and 4-25 here??

I included five cells from 4-45 when doing 4-9. The WG -> Ash transition was desperately needed here. In my opinion 4-45 is mostly ok as it is, and only need a minor touch up when finalizing the entire region.

The dustbowl concept I've been mostly faithful to creating the other borders of the Armun ashlands should also be included here, and since the western border is RM/MA the eastern border could really be different in my humble opinion. Having Theo finish his claim with RM/MA border is my suggestion, and then leaving the final touch up to me and/or Haplo or whoever when the map is finalized.

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Post Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:50 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

Yes, I meant 4-25, my apologies. Your stuff on 4-45 is really brilliant, as per usual! Smile

The western and eastern borders could be different, although only the eastern-most (facing TRV; e.g. 4-25) would be WG: the stuff bordering the RR would be Grazelands, I assume?

But all this is really your call, as HoE. Your wider vision > mine.

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a man builds a city
with
Banks and Cathedrals
a man melts the sand so he
can see the world outside


"They destroyed Morrowind? Fiddlesticks! Now we're going to have to rebuild it again!"
Post Sat Mar 06, 2010 2:59 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Theo
Developer Emeritus
16 Dec 2004

Location: PRAGUE

Sorry, but considering the neighbouring claims and size of mine claim, I find it quite impossible to fulfil grandious visions of on cell wide monumental entrance to AL.

Please revoke this after all. PhD exams will be in 3 weeks I could't work on this anyway. I submit the newest file.

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Post Sat Mar 06, 2010 3:49 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Revoked as per modder request :( .
Post Sat Mar 06, 2010 3:59 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

If it wouldn't be too unorthodox, could I have a go at this? I've worked with exteriors before, doing some fixing on Map 2 inter-claim borders, and in any case this claim is already more than half done, and Theo's work is obviously all very good, so it would only really be texture tweaking and static placing needing doing, with little landscaping.

If I can, I'll provide a WIP by Wednesday/Thursday that can be checked to see if I'm too crap to be allowed to continue

If I can't, would it be okay if I threw up an update to Theo's file which extends the path through the mountains into the Ashlands a bit. Just because I toyed around with it and it seems good?
Post Sat Mar 06, 2010 9:28 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Nemon
Developer Emeritus
18 Oct 2003

Location: Bergen

Have fun, I have more than enough knowledge to make this shine :) .
Post Sat Mar 06, 2010 9:39 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Bloodthirsty Crustacean
Developer Emeritus
02 Feb 2007

Location: Elsewhere

Finished.

The file I've uploaded includes two cells, one from 4-9 and 4-49 respectively, additional to the claim itself. These are very minor geographical and static-placement tweaks to make the mountain flow properly. I'm not sure if the proper merging protocol would be to remove these from my claim and insert them in their originals, or just clean the old cells out of the originals and leave my mods in here, or what. Just saying what's going on.

I have left the eastern border vague, as Theo's red marker seemed to suggest. It looks like 4-25 is one of those claims which is going to be changing a lot in the near future, so trying to second guess it is probably a waste of everyone's time. I might suggest linking up the Armun border mountains between this claim and 4-25, by extending my mountains southeast from the 'MA spire' in the south eastern corner, and linking up with those in 25, and also making those RM/MA. Or maybe just adding some more 'intentional' valley type construct. That all really needs the claims to be merged first, and 4-25 to be settled, though.

Overall, I'm very happy with what I produced. Hope it looks alright to the trained eyes amongst us as well!

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a man builds a city
with
Banks and Cathedrals
a man melts the sand so he
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"They destroyed Morrowind? Fiddlesticks! Now we're going to have to rebuild it again!"
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