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Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

Hm. I'm not sure about starting work on the Dres set again; architecture is tied to society, and we haven't really figured out Dres society yet. If we do too much on the modelling front now, the models may end up not matching our vision for House Dres. And rather than trying to figure out House Dres now, I'd rather we tried to focus on the Houses we are working on.

However, there's a very similar task that needs doing; the Indoril lower-class tileset, which will mostly be needed for Almalexia. This could mostly consist of interiors with no hallways, like the velothicave set but modular. I had a concept of how the exterior could look, but photobucket swallowed it, so I'd have to re-scan it. If you feel up to it, I could have a try at the functional concepts.

Unless I'm forgetting something, the list of assets needed for the set might look something like this:

First, the exterior:



Keeping in mind that that is an old image, so it's strictly to establish the general look.

Next, a quick mock-up to give an idea of what I'm going for:



center03 should read corner02; I forgot to fix that. I may play around a bit with the textures yet, but for the time being those four should cover it. The loaddoor I'm using is d\Door_redoran_tower_01.nif, a door that was never used in vanilla Morrowind, and while its ivory panels should get their textures switched out as in the mockup the wood texture can stay, and be used for the other door as well.

The list of assets:

TR_door_Ind_LC_door - large rectangular swinging door
TR_door_Ind_LC_loaddoor - d\Door_redoran_tower_01.nif model with retextured panels
TR_door_Ind_LC_trapbot - trapdoor in ceiling with ladder access.
TR_door_Ind_LC_traptop - trapdoor in floor.

TR_ex_Ind_LC_entr - exterior doorway
TR_ex_Ind_LC_win - exterior window

TR_in_Ind_LC_center - ceiling with floor piece
TR_in_Ind_LC_column
TR_in_Ind_LC_corner01
TR_in_Ind_LC_corner02 - same but without walls
TR_in_Ind_LC_doorway01 - for TR_door_Ind_LC_loaddoor; doorway should be high with steps leading up
TR_in_Ind_LC_doorway02 - for TR_door_Ind_LC_door; two-sided
TR_in_Ind_LC_hearth - wall piece with hearth inset
TR_in_Ind_LC_niche01 - wall with a horizontal niche for a bed
TR_in_Ind_LC_niche02 - wall with horizontal niches for two beds
TR_in_Ind_LC_niche03 - vertical niche left side
TR_in_Ind_LC_niche04 - vertical niche right side
TR_in_Ind_LC_niche05 - vertical niches both sides
TR_in_Ind_LC_partition - two-sided wall piece
TR_in_Ind_LC_side01 - ceiling, floor and one wall
TR_in_Ind_LC_side02 - same but without wall
TR_in_Ind_LC_wall - wall piece
TR_in_Ind_LC_win - interior window



Each asset is shown from at least three perspectives: from, from the front and from the side. The red squares show the size of a typical tile; 256 by 256 units. The darker grid lines designate 16 unit intervals, the lighter 8 unit intervals.

All of the images can also be seen in this Imgur album.


Last edited by Gnomey on Wed May 27, 2015 1:47 pm; edited 8 times in total
Post Wed May 20, 2015 9:47 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
SACarrow
Member
03 Dec 2007

Location: Tampa, Florida, USA

Gnomey: I have no objection to doing the Indoril stuff first. My interest is primarily in taking stuff that's almost there like the Skyrender and taking it over the finish line. I'll admit that the Dres intrigue me as well. But if the Indoril stuff would be more immediately useful, that's OK too. That would not be the first modular tileset I've worked on.

A couple of caveats:
- I'm much more of a technician than an artist, so I'll need concept art with at least a rough idea of proportion.
- Not much of a texture artist either. Smile A good 2D artist (like 10Kaziem) would be a big help here and would need "concept colors" as well. Also good suggestions for placeholder texes for UV mapping would be appreciated.

Feel free to split this off into its own thread.

Thanks,
Steve
Post Wed May 20, 2015 11:17 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

I have plenty of graph paper lying around, so I should be able to get some pretty precise drawings. As far as textures are concerned, the MH textures should do perfectly fine, at least to start with.
Post Wed May 20, 2015 11:45 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Ironed Maidens
Developer
23 Feb 2008



I still think that the current Dres models we have now just need to be curved out a bit and re-textured and it could be used perfectly for the Indoril.
Post Thu May 21, 2015 1:29 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
10Kaziem
Lead Developer
03 Apr 2015



I'm definitely available for textures.
Post Thu May 21, 2015 2:30 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
st.Veloth, The Repenting
Member
28 Feb 2015

Location: toronto

hmmmmm. any concept art needed? i would be happy to supply some.
_________________
almsivi bless, to create one must first destroy, the nature of all, is in equilibrium
- sotha sil
Post Thu May 21, 2015 2:36 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

First, the exterior:



Keeping in mind that that is an old image, so it's strictly to establish the general look.

Next, a quick mock-up to give an idea of what I'm going for:



center03 should read corner02; I forgot to fix that. I may play around a bit with the textures yet, but for the time being those four should cover it. The loaddoor I'm using is d\Door_redoran_tower_01.nif, a door that was never used in vanilla Morrowind, and while its ivory panels should get their textures switched out as in the mockup the wood texture can stay, and be used for the other door as well.

An updated list of assets:

TR_door_Ind_LC_door - large rectangular swinging door
TR_door_Ind_LC_loaddoor - d\Door_redoran_tower_01.nif model with retextured panels
TR_door_Ind_LC_trapbot - trapdoor in ceiling with ladder access.
TR_door_Ind_LC_traptop - trapdoor in floor.

TR_ex_Ind_LC_entr - exterior doorway
TR_ex_Ind_LC_win - exterior window

TR_in_Ind_LC_center - ceiling with floor piece
TR_in_Ind_LC_column
TR_in_Ind_LC_corner01
TR_in_Ind_LC_corner02 - same but without walls
TR_in_Ind_LC_doorway01 - for TR_door_Ind_LC_loaddoor; doorway should be high with steps leading up
TR_in_Ind_LC_doorway02 - for TR_door_Ind_LC_door; two-sided
TR_in_Ind_LC_hearth - wall piece with hearth inset
TR_in_Ind_LC_niche01 - wall with a horizontal niche for a bed
TR_in_Ind_LC_niche02 - wall with horizontal niches for two beds
TR_in_Ind_LC_niche0... - vertical niche variations for storage, etc.
TR_in_Ind_LC_partition - two-sided wall piece
TR_in_Ind_LC_side01 - ceiling, floor and one wall
TR_in_Ind_LC_side02 - same but without wall
TR_in_Ind_LC_wall - wall piece
TR_in_Ind_LC_win - interior window

Post Thu May 21, 2015 12:59 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
10Kaziem
Lead Developer
03 Apr 2015



Sounds like, at the moment, no new textures are needed. Correct?
Post Thu May 21, 2015 1:37 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

Yeah, not at the moment, certainly. It's possible something will come up later, but I'm intentionally trying to keep the set very bare-bones.
Post Thu May 21, 2015 2:13 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
SACarrow
Member
03 Dec 2007

Location: Tampa, Florida, USA

Gnomey: I really liked the drawing of the Indoril exterior. It seems that I should pattern the interiors after the lower tier, which brings up some thoughts:

- Do the pieces comprising the Indoril plaza/canton exist yet? I was thinking of either using those pieces for dimensional patterning or maybe making those first as a intro to this set.
- It looks like those tiers could contain two stories, so I'm thinking of allowing for that in the set.

OK, I only had two thoughts. Maybe more later. Smile

Steve
Post Thu May 21, 2015 9:04 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
st.Veloth, The Repenting
Member
28 Feb 2015

Location: toronto

perhaps a grittier less polished look... more velothi canton like
_________________
almsivi bless, to create one must first destroy, the nature of all, is in equilibrium
- sotha sil
Post Thu May 21, 2015 9:06 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

@st. Veloth: from my limited understanding of asset production, the gritty look would be one of the last things done to the model; I think it's generally done through vertex colouring. I certainly wouldn't want the LC set to look pristine.

@SACarrow: yes, the lower tier. The outer walls already exist; you can see such a wall section in the other image used as a texture reference. It's much larger than it looks; the models used as texture references are all not to scale. The only models in the exterior image that do not exist are the lower tier doorways and windows.
As for two stories, the lower walls are not supposed to be completely hollow, or they would not support the buildings above. Some interiors might have two floors, but that can be handled by connecting two rooms via the trapdoors.

Edit: hopefully I'll be able to post the first three concepts tomorrow; I started with the basic center, corner01 and side01 pieces.
Post Thu May 21, 2015 10:18 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
st.Veloth, The Repenting
Member
28 Feb 2015

Location: toronto

houses on houses on larger houses, like clusters of fungus
_________________
almsivi bless, to create one must first destroy, the nature of all, is in equilibrium
- sotha sil
Post Thu May 21, 2015 11:32 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

First set of concepts:

see first post

From top to bottom, the rows show the ceiling view (looking up), the front view and the side view of each asset. From left to right, the assets are: TR_in_Ind_LC_corner01, TR_in_Ind_LC_side01 and TR_in_Ind_LC_center.

The red boxes represent 256*256 units, so the size of a standard tile. The darker grey lines mark 16 unit intervals. They are subdivided by the lighter grey lines, which mark 8 unit intervals. Half of that again is 4 units, and I generally won't get any finer than that.

I've kept the concepts pretty clean so far; please tell me any additional information you'd like to see.

Edit: I may want to bevel the corner of the corner01 piece, but I'd like to see how it looks as-is first.

Edit2: Hm. This method is quicker than I had expected. Next set of concepts: TR_in_Ind_LC_corner02, TR_in_Ind_LC_side02 and TR_in_Ind_LC_wall. I could go on, but I think I'll wait for feedback before doing more. I'll be adding all of the concepts to this album as well as posting them here.

see first post


Last edited by Gnomey on Mon May 25, 2015 2:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
Post Fri May 22, 2015 11:02 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
st.Veloth, The Repenting
Member
28 Feb 2015

Location: toronto

i got some concepts coming... just wait..
_________________
almsivi bless, to create one must first destroy, the nature of all, is in equilibrium
- sotha sil
Post Sat May 23, 2015 2:41 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

Hm. Change of approach: I'll be keeping the asset list in the first post updated, and will hyperlink each asset ID in the list with its respective concept. Later I'll upload a simple legend for the textures.

Edit: added the column piece. As the column capital has inset faces, I've added additional cross-section views of the capital; one from the top down and one from the side.

Edit2: added the partition. Depending on how I end up handling the hearth, this could very well end up being the most complex model of the set. I plan to create a separate image in which all the individual components are labelled and explained.
Post Mon May 25, 2015 2:35 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

The legend for the partition concept. As always, please tell me if anything is unclear; I feel as though the legend didn't end up quite as intuitive as I'd hoped...

Post Wed May 27, 2015 12:04 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
st.Veloth, The Repenting
Member
28 Feb 2015

Location: toronto

a more squared and cluttered look would fit the urban jungle idea well, darker and more "impoverished" textures would fit in as well
_________________
almsivi bless, to create one must first destroy, the nature of all, is in equilibrium
- sotha sil
Post Wed May 27, 2015 12:53 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

As far as textures are concerned, as I said before, for the time being they are mostly irrelevant. These are functional concepts which are supposed to act as blueprints for the modeller to use in making the model. Only once the models are created would we need to sort out the textures. For all intents and purposes we could use the colour scheme of the legend in my last post for the time being.
I'm specifically keeping the colours I am using light so that they won't distract from the lines, which are the most important part of these concepts. If the colours were too dark, the modeller wouldn't be able to make out the lines as well.
As far as squared is concerned, the tileset is already fairly square overall. The reason the walls are curved is to conform to the massive foundation pieces the LC homes will be built into, as seen in the first post, as well as to maintain some semblance of organic form. The reason the partition includes curves is to conform to the walls. These dwellings are supposed to be reminiscent of cave dwellings; a bit of a mixture between cave dwellings, Velothi architecture, the Dunmer stronghold tileset and Old Mournhold architecture, made to fit in with Mournhold architecture.

As for a cluttered look, I think a fairly severe, destitute look is better fit to the purpose of this tileset than a cluttered look. This tileset is used by the poorest free Dunmer in Indoril lands; so poor they might as well be living in caves. So poor they are arguably not really free, but dependent on the Indoril. So poor these dwellings were probably built and lent to them by Indoril rather than belonging to them. Rather than homes, these dwellings are almost cells, though tenements would probably be the more direct comparison. Their inhabitants generally have few belongings, and, as with many tenements, those few belongings strewn about the house would provide the cluttered look. If anything, I'm a little worried that the partition concept is too cluttered.
Post Wed May 27, 2015 1:32 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Saltrice
Member
14 Feb 2015

Location: Aharasaplit Camp

This thread inspired me to investigate whether i knew anything about modelling to help forward in this task, turns out that this field of expertise is truly an alien world to me. I did try to make some custom dwarven maces last year, using some freeware programs, (because every nerevarine should have nice things) unfortunately that project was never completed. if I'm having any holiday this year I'm certainly returning to these studies, expect results in... I really don't know when.

What I can tell for certain is that it would be nice to have some more cave-like dwellings in cities of Morrowind, including Indoril settlements. I remember having wondered why the town of Gnisis was the only place with those interesting cave dwellings for lower class people, and used to search for those elsewhere too.
Post Wed May 27, 2015 9:28 pm Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Ironed Maidens
Developer
23 Feb 2008



Caves....









[/img]
Post Thu May 28, 2015 12:59 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
10Kaziem
Lead Developer
03 Apr 2015



I do not know what those carrot yam things are but they are amazing and I want them.
Post Thu May 28, 2015 1:42 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
Gnomey
Lead Developer
19 May 2006

Location: In your garden.

I think Swiftoak suggested there be cave dwellings at the southern parameter of the Sundered Scar (formerly Inlet Bog) region, which is an idea I like. I also suggested those cave dwellings be used around Indoril castle-estates to house the estate's slaves. I think adding some cave dwellings to Redoran lands would also -- naturally -- be a good idea. If you can't tell by now, I'm rather a fan of them myself.

The carrot yam things do look interesting, but keep in mind that this thread is for the discussion and development of the Indoril LC set. Razz
Post Thu May 28, 2015 11:16 am Send private message             Reply with quote                   up  
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