Claim 6-1: Ald Mar
Moderators: Haplo, Lead Developers
Claim 6-1: Ald Mar
For the benefit of Garland....
All discussions of Ald Mar will be here. Start anew and fresh.
Good luck and Happy Modding.
Yinnie.
All discussions of Ald Mar will be here. Start anew and fresh.
Good luck and Happy Modding.
Yinnie.
- Hermit
- Developer Emeritus
- Posts: 2373
- Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2003 8:59 pm
- Location: The North German plains
Your wish is my command, mylady.Now.... Ald Mar .... Layouts, etc.. Anyone with ideas that will help Garland?
Sadly, I have no screens of Indoril Old Keep, but if it follows the terrain outlines of the old, Imperial Old Keep, I'd say make the island fortified, and go for a sort of Mount St.Michelle look, only with those wonderfully sinister Dres models. Especially the revamped ones, which look even greater than those that are in use right now.
The island should be completely walled, using the terrain available, and thus making it a formidable fort. Also, the bridges should have a drawbridge component, to add in the fortress feeling of the city. Maybe even add some water outlets (more things yet to be modeled) below the water line, secured like those in Vivec.
The city itself should be cramped, without any great plazas, and not as flat as the average Bethesda city either. More like a San Francisco feeling, instead of LA, if you want. Maybe a road, spiralling upwards, all houses rather towerlike, only few of the one-story Dres buildings, and at the top, a small palace for the local land lord/resident councillor. Also, the mountain would provide great dungeon opportunities, as in hollowed out mountain and secrets buried beneath the city - maybe an old daedric site, still in use by the daedra-worshipping Dres? Also, where the real councillor, that vampire, lives?
Maybe, as Dres will have seven major cities, each of them should have a hidden daedric site dedicated to one of the Chimeric Daedra, Azura, Mephala, Boethida, Mehrunes Dagon, Molag Bal, Sheogorath, and Malacath? Justan idea. Hey, we could even use this for the Dres Main Quest, MMQ, and even TMQ!
So, let's hope this thread will tremain friendly and civil; unlike it's ill-fated predecessor.
For the record, what has been descided is descided, no discussion on "why" and "if", as of now, let's focus on "how best to". and only that.
Elder Mod.
For now, I'm sleeping in my lightless city beneath the waves.
But someday ... I will be back.
Fthagn.
For now, I'm sleeping in my lightless city beneath the waves.
But someday ... I will be back.
Fthagn.
-
- Developer Emeritus
- Posts: 266
- Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2003 10:53 am
- Location: That state that keeps screwing up the elections
- Contact:
I just want to point out something about the faction lines. They are not based on some set in stone lore map that has the faction lines layed out. All we had were general areas, Indoril in the center, Redoran in the west, Telvanni in the east, Dres in the south/south east, and Hlaalu everywhere else. The faction map has been BS'ed and drawn and then decided to be changed and BS'ed again and redrawn based on those general areas several times now. So its not like its some huge crime to make Old Keep Dres because its in "Indoril Territory" because that area being indoril was arbitrary based on the fact that someone decided Old Keep should be Indoril.
[url=http://www.ifilm.com/ifilmdetail/2652831]Jon Stewart is my hero[/url]
I like hermit's idea. It's fitting with house dres's character for their towns to be tightly enclosed with very little open area.
The town is built on top of an ancient ruin of some sort, possibly dwemer. The real councilor, who is a vampire, lives in this ruin, therefore, the ruins are sealed off (probably just a locked door with a lock level of 0)
There are around 15-20 buildings in the town. The town is built upon 3 floors, each floor smaller then the last one. The first and the second floor have a small walkway around the outside. The first floor has as many buildings as I can fit in it, a support beam for the next floor, and two entrances. The second floor is on a platform, with a circle of buildings, and a support beam in the center of the room. It also has an exit to the walkway around the keep. The top of the fort would be be open air, with a small garden where the landings were on the other floors, the garden doesn't take up the whole floor though, because the palace is behind it, with a little path through the garden to it. The palace would also have a back door to a balcony
I'm not quite sure how big it will need to be, and how the spiral walkway will be able to go over the buildings easily enough, but I'll figure it out. It could probably be done with a shorter building than the normal 3 story one.
So far, the new models required would be:
The keep itself
Drawbridges
The palace
2 new "tall" buildings. (one that is smaller, and one that is different, to break up the monotony.)
The town is built on top of an ancient ruin of some sort, possibly dwemer. The real councilor, who is a vampire, lives in this ruin, therefore, the ruins are sealed off (probably just a locked door with a lock level of 0)
There are around 15-20 buildings in the town. The town is built upon 3 floors, each floor smaller then the last one. The first and the second floor have a small walkway around the outside. The first floor has as many buildings as I can fit in it, a support beam for the next floor, and two entrances. The second floor is on a platform, with a circle of buildings, and a support beam in the center of the room. It also has an exit to the walkway around the keep. The top of the fort would be be open air, with a small garden where the landings were on the other floors, the garden doesn't take up the whole floor though, because the palace is behind it, with a little path through the garden to it. The palace would also have a back door to a balcony
I'm not quite sure how big it will need to be, and how the spiral walkway will be able to go over the buildings easily enough, but I'll figure it out. It could probably be done with a shorter building than the normal 3 story one.
So far, the new models required would be:
The keep itself
Drawbridges
The palace
2 new "tall" buildings. (one that is smaller, and one that is different, to break up the monotony.)
claims:
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
I've actually decided that a round shape is not the best, it's very difficult to put square buildings against round walls. The fort will be octagonal. I've also decided not to put the staircase in the same room as the buildings, it will instead be a separate shaft. (like in an imperial fort, that have the towers with spiral staircases.)
claims:
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
-
- Developer
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:08 pm
- Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota, USA
- Contact:
Thanks, though technically it's not your name, but you did help unravel the meaning of Mar and notify me of the fact that there was a better name, so I thank you, sirwootalot. 8)
The keep will also need a staircase on the outside that goes down to the docks. It will need a shaft below the manor on the top, that leads down into the ruins below.
The keep will also need a staircase on the outside that goes down to the docks. It will need a shaft below the manor on the top, that leads down into the ruins below.
claims:
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
Well, the computer I had the one I was working on...basically died. So I guess I'll have to start over again, unless I want to wait to get that computers hard drive back into some sort of way to where I can get stuffs off it. Meh, I hadn't done all that much, I'd mainly been working on some other things and waiting for veet to finish converting a dres building. I'll need to get someone to draw a concept sketch of Ald Mar so somebody can model it.
claims:
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
-
- Developer Emeritus
- Posts: 212
- Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2003 11:11 am
- Location: On some deserted island beyond the sea of ghost
- Contact:
My ass if it's not a huge deal to change it to dres.
Jesus..
You can't cut that down.
Dres shouldn't be a large house at all, it's the smallest house in all of morrowind.
And Indoril is the largest.
You can't just cut that down.
Nazz I totally disagree whit you on that.
This is a huge deal.
Dres has nothing to do so far north as that.
I belive it should stay Imperial.
If only becus of Name I whould think is should stay like it was.
But also becus of the location.
Dres should never be able to hold such a strategic possission.
You have three large cities that have to trade whit this one city.
Gah Rhun - Silnim Dale - Kogo Aimrah
All trade from these cities should go trough Old Keep.
If you want to give dres any areas give them Aryon Jungle.
Anyway. What happend to the old town?
Jesus..
You can't cut that down.
Dres shouldn't be a large house at all, it's the smallest house in all of morrowind.
And Indoril is the largest.
You can't just cut that down.
Nazz I totally disagree whit you on that.
This is a huge deal.
Dres has nothing to do so far north as that.
I belive it should stay Imperial.
If only becus of Name I whould think is should stay like it was.
But also becus of the location.
Dres should never be able to hold such a strategic possission.
You have three large cities that have to trade whit this one city.
Gah Rhun - Silnim Dale - Kogo Aimrah
All trade from these cities should go trough Old Keep.
If you want to give dres any areas give them Aryon Jungle.
Anyway. What happend to the old town?
If you don't bother with your past history. How do you know where your currently at? It's past what makes us who we are. And who we will be. Ignoring that, is ignoring who we are and where we're going.
- Túrelio
- Developer
- Posts: 934
- Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 1:10 am
- Location: Georgia, USA
- Contact:
I am not sure making it Dres would be a huge shift in power would it? Indoril already controls the Capital of Morrowind, and alot of territory, it is fairly undisputed even with Hlaalu's recent land grab. Also, Tear is mentioned as a Major port of the East, so obviously Dres has something here, what would be so wrong with this? I am not say it should or shouldn't be either so you know.
I never said I personally didn't like the city that was originally there, but many changes have already been made because of the decision to change it to dres. I'm not going to change it to something else, it's already been changed too much.
Well, on a progress note, I have downloaded all my neighboring claims, it's gonna be difficult lining this thing up... Oh, and also, I HATE it when people submit their claim without lining it up. Thankfully, his shouldn't be too difficult to line up with.
You wouldn't believe how tired I am of hearing that. Dres is a GREAT HOUSE, it should have more than 1 town, and 1 city, so stop complaining. The problem is, is that with that few towns, it would already have been absorbed into one of the other houses. Saying that one more town isn't gonna help, is true, but a few others have been converted as well. The reason we need more "towns", instead of "plantations", is because, plantations are not going to have shops, inns, or guilds.Dres shouldn't be a large house at all, it's the smallest house in all of morrowind.
Well, on a progress note, I have downloaded all my neighboring claims, it's gonna be difficult lining this thing up... Oh, and also, I HATE it when people submit their claim without lining it up. Thankfully, his shouldn't be too difficult to line up with.
claims:
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
If anyone is waiting on me to line this up, then don't worry about it. I'll be gone for the next week. I'll update this thread when I line it up. I'm just gonna post my mod that will have been modified to be as close as possible to yours, and then you can line yours up with that, that way I don't have to have the latest versions of your claims.
claims:
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
-
- Developer
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:08 pm
- Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota, USA
- Contact:
Unless there is a model already, you don't need a new model for the keep- you can just use the dres canal models (ask munkie if you want to use them). I find they can really make a place look fortified; and if you use them then you can make indoor plazas (when dres interior architechture arrives) and a sewer.
"Crashing the game is an innovative way of alerting the player that they've finished the quest, but I'm not sure that's the kind of innovation we're looking for." - Sload
What I've seen you already have quite a few dres city, coupled with the fact that near the whole south-east is covered with plantation. Noone others have converted from their orignally planned faction.Garland wrote:I never said I personally didn't like the city that was originally there, but many changes have already been made because of the decision to change it to dres. I'm not going to change it to something else, it's already been changed too much.
You wouldn't believe how tired I am of hearing that. Dres is a GREAT HOUSE, it should have more than 1 town, and 1 city, so stop complaining. The problem is, is that with that few towns, it would already have been absorbed into one of the other houses. Saying that one more town isn't gonna help, is true, but a few others have been converted as well. The reason we need more "towns", instead of "plantations", is because, plantations are not going to have shops, inns, or guilds.Dres shouldn't be a large house at all, it's the smallest house in all of morrowind.
Well, on a progress note, I have downloaded all my neighboring claims, it's gonna be difficult lining this thing up... Oh, and also, I HATE it when people submit their claim without lining it up. Thankfully, his shouldn't be too difficult to line up with.
- Túrelio
- Developer
- Posts: 934
- Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 1:10 am
- Location: Georgia, USA
- Contact:
While House Dres is considered the smallest of the Great Houses, I think this is just because they are not as expansive as the other Great Houses. All the other houses have holdings on Vvardenfell, even Indoril to a sense with its ties to the Temple, however they have been in power for a very long time anyways.
Dres on the other hand seemed more interested in where they are now, and probably it is because they are doing fine with it. Dres is very wealthy, because of it's many plantations. Also considering that they haven't expanded, it may well be likely that they have more close together cities, denser population then the rest of the Houses.
Dres on the other hand seemed more interested in where they are now, and probably it is because they are doing fine with it. Dres is very wealthy, because of it's many plantations. Also considering that they haven't expanded, it may well be likely that they have more close together cities, denser population then the rest of the Houses.
-
- Developer
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:08 pm
- Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota, USA
- Contact:
Exactly; this is why I added a dres town which I have now found to be bigger than corkarth (corkarth has 15 buildings, balsan mar has 25 (counting the pass)).
"Crashing the game is an innovative way of alerting the player that they've finished the quest, but I'm not sure that's the kind of innovation we're looking for." - Sload
-
- Developer
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:08 pm
- Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota, USA
- Contact:
I appreciate your sarcasm, koth . quite frankly, it would SUCK if everyone did that! however, we are following lore, and lore says the mainland is more densely populated than vvardenfell. Just helping out that statement. Besides, my town only takes up one cell, and there are only something like 4 other new towns that have more than 15 buildings (Darconis, Dondril, Kha'ank, and Tel Ouada I believe).
"Crashing the game is an innovative way of alerting the player that they've finished the quest, but I'm not sure that's the kind of innovation we're looking for." - Sload
- Túrelio
- Developer
- Posts: 934
- Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 1:10 am
- Location: Georgia, USA
- Contact:
-
- Developer
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:08 pm
- Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota, USA
- Contact:
it WAS planned, in the "dres cities" thread. Also, I don't really appreciate someone waiting two whole months to tell me my city won't work out, and I thought the whole team knew about the place anyways.
"Crashing the game is an innovative way of alerting the player that they've finished the quest, but I'm not sure that's the kind of innovation we're looking for." - Sload
- Kothloth
- Developer Emeritus
- Posts: 886
- Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2003 11:33 am
- Location: Beppu, Japan
- Contact:
I personally don't read up on everything on these boards. I tend to keep to my own areas, and map 6-16 and house Dres isn't one of them, which is the reason beyond this late reply. I only say that these kind of things *must* be clearly brought to attension so that corrections for it may be made. Adding it on maps, giving the place a purpose etc. A city with 25 interiors isn't a small place. It will most likely need some kind of transporation, binding it to a quickroute and in an instant, it has turned into quite the important city. Which is also the reason one can't simply add this without being sure it can be made. I wont tell you to raze your city to the ground, but I would ask if you could somehow try to make it unimportant. Easiest way to reach this is to remove interiors I guess. If you get the amont down at 10-15, then it will still be within acceptable limits for a made up village. That would leave no hassle, and it can't be such a grand change? Judging from your screenshot, you've place the common buildings very tight. If you remove one inbetween each two houses, you could probably reach this limit without having the city itself changed a lot. Place a marketstand or a nice tree inplace of the buildings, and it wont really affect the place as whole I would say. Atleast try to do this, since it would conciderable cut down the overall work, since a bigger city would need it's own set of guilds and quests for it to have a purpose. And for every such city we add, an other 25+ hour of work will be needed. Not to mention the extra 10 interiors...
Uh, I don't think this discussion of 6-16 needs to carry on in my thread.
Well, now my neighbor to the left has submitted his damn claim, and it's way freaking off from mine. Just to teach him a lesson, I'll not line up with him, he shouldn't have a border 300 feet high when there's a river in the next cell to the left! And HE was wanting me to line up with him!!!!!!!!
If someone knows whether or not his border is still that way, feel free to tell me.
Well, now my neighbor to the left has submitted his damn claim, and it's way freaking off from mine. Just to teach him a lesson, I'll not line up with him, he shouldn't have a border 300 feet high when there's a river in the next cell to the left! And HE was wanting me to line up with him!!!!!!!!
If someone knows whether or not his border is still that way, feel free to tell me.
claims:
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
-
- Developer
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:08 pm
- Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota, USA
- Contact:
Funny you're yelling, as the best solution is something you yourself made.
Try using one of your cliff models on the side of the river, and if its too big it can easily be scaled down.
Try using one of your cliff models on the side of the river, and if its too big it can easily be scaled down.
"Crashing the game is an innovative way of alerting the player that they've finished the quest, but I'm not sure that's the kind of innovation we're looking for." - Sload
Okay, I've lined up as best I could, so if anybody hasn't already submitted their claim, then they can line up with this.
Also of note, my computer is going even more insane now, the cd drive is randomly popping out.
Also of note, my computer is going even more insane now, the cd drive is randomly popping out.
- Attachments
-
- Clean TR_6-1_GD lined up.zip
- (96.83 KiB) Downloaded 64 times
claims:
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
No, it's not.
That's for my neighbors to line up with. It's not the final version. That's probably what happened to that neighbor of mine... He left for a week, posted a version of his mod, it was added to the map, he came back, and then it was opened for claiming...
That's for my neighbors to line up with. It's not the final version. That's probably what happened to that neighbor of mine... He left for a week, posted a version of his mod, it was added to the map, he came back, and then it was opened for claiming...
claims:
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
4-21 - completed
5-12 - completed
-
- Developer
- Posts: 70
- Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 11:08 pm
- Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota, USA
- Contact: