Dun Akafell

Legolas55 · Post by **Legolas55** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 3:43 pm

This thread is for the interiors of Dun Akafell. Since it is big, several people will be working on it. If you want to help, just post here.

Here are the people who are working on it so far:

Legolas
Vegor
Majra
Prometheus
Turelio
Silvone
Sirwootalot

Feel free to tell us any ideas. We are only doing interiors now but we have to discuss the quests and NPC's, yet we are not actually making them until they may be claimed. Before any interior work begins, we'll have to make a sketch layout of the city.

Besides caves and old mournhold halls, we only have two buildings, the ones used in the dark brotherhood hideout. More will be needed for the city part. They do not have to be as fancy as the DB buildings, but they should show some detail and style of old mournhold.

I have an idea for the city part. It was some visual idea I had a few years ago that would fit this city. I'll try to draw it.

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 3:50 pm

And I took a look at old Mournhold and come to the conclusion we need quite a lot of new meshes if we plan to create it as I imagined. Here's the idea I had:

When you enter the tunnels from above ground, you first have to walk through tunnels (mournhold sewer-style) for some time which seems to go deeper and deeper into the ground. Then suddenly when walking around a corner in the tunnels, before you opens up a gigantic underground cave and within it the underground city of Dun Akafell. It should look almost like a normal city at some parts (though old and worn, with some buidlings collapsed and so on), while other parts should be buried by rubble or go into the cave walls (that would be Old Mournhold style).
Now the problem is, that such a huge cave can't be made using the current meshes. I think we need new meshes for the cave, seperate meshes for floor, walls and ceiling, so we can make it as high as we want. I imagined the ceiling being nearly (perhaps even completely) out of sight when standing on the floor since it's huge height.

Majra · Post by **Majra** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 3:56 pm

I can do the mesh work for the group, after this week Im gonna be back to my awesome old self

Also, being a civ engineer, id love to give a crack at the city layout

Legolas55 · Post by **Legolas55** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 3:58 pm

Ah, yes, what luck. I was thinking you could do some mesh work Majra, but I didn't want to push you since you said you wouldn't be meshing for a bit. Look at In_DB_front and In_DB_front01 to see the style. I'm going to try to make some very simple buildings and use that tan texture.

If you've ever played the game Riven, there's the home of the rebels who live in this huge city in this giant tree that is a sphere on the top. There's a picture of the interior of the tree and it looks a lot like this Dun Akafell is supposed to look. If I can get that picture, I'll show you.

Vegor, I really like your idea for the layout.

prometheus · Post by **prometheus** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:04 pm

i agree with that vision of the city .. it is about on how i immagined it to be ... but since i never tried to make interiors i didnÃ‚Â´t step in ...anyway i thing that huge caves can be easily built with normal meshes....we have already them just mount them up.....for creating great caves....

Majra · Post by **Majra** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:04 pm

ok cool, also, maybe we could get vorrheis to make us a basalisk or something, its almost dragon like, and very very dangerous.... might fit the need for the baddie

prometheus · Post by **prometheus** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:13 pm

befoure planning take a walk in the exterior claim ... uÃ‚Â´ll find a statue that could inspire the quest ....

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:19 pm

Sizing up the normal cave ints won't be enough I'm afraid. All the caves are just prefab rooms and not seperate floor/ceiling/walls. This isn't neccesary but I think the size we need is more than twice the size of normal caves, and scale 2.00 is the max amount you can upscale an object. Therefore I think we need new meshes.

I was alos thinking about mushrooms growing in the city. Mushrooms tend to grow in such dark, dry places. The mushrooms in the game, however, all grow in the light, so perhaps we have to create new mushroom meshes for the underground. I can do meshes myself, but I can't texture so it's better someone who can do textures creates the meshes.

I already have something in mind on the first view one gets on the city. It will be some kind of plaze with a grand building on the other side, and smaller buidlings on the left and right.

I think there should be goblins in the tunnels leading to it, and perhaps some other areas with things to do. Very much like the Mournhold sewers, yet a bit more linear, leading in one main direction - down.

prometheus · Post by **prometheus** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:23 pm

thatÃ‚Â´s a good idea ....but what about the already exhisting mushrooms and crystals?

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:25 pm

It's fine with me, if no one has any objection against it. It would be a bit odd that these mushrooms that usually grow in sunlight and outside conditions would also florish in a complete different environment.

Legolas55 · Post by **Legolas55** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:28 pm

I have gotten the idea of the layout after looking at the exterior. Is that big statue supposed to be Nerevar or someone else?

prometheus · Post by **prometheus** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:34 pm

Nerevar???
it is a Daedra statue...but i do not remember the name....

Legolas55 · Post by **Legolas55** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:44 pm

Nevermind, it just looked like trueflame, but I didn't realize the face was wrong. Forget I said that.

Because it is male, it could be one of three: Peryite, Clavicus Vile, or Sanguine. There are also others which I can't tell whether they're male or female.

Silvone Elestahr · Post by **Silvone Elestahr** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 5:16 pm

Can I help out on this claim? I'm good with interiors and I can help out with the quests (though I cant actually write them) and a storyline for it.

Legolas55 · Post by **Legolas55** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 5:27 pm

Sure, you can help out. We need as much help as we can get.

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 5:40 pm

It could have a nice saying on the entrances. In the style of Tolkien's paths of the dead (.. made by those who are dead and the dead keep it). Not the same, but something similar. That you know for sure to beware once you venture inside.

Legolas55 · Post by **Legolas55** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 5:51 pm

Great idea Vegor. Maybe it could be some kind of riddle that gives you a clue about the quest having to do with it.

I have been working on a model all this morning for a building. Like Vegor, I can't really texture, but it shouldn't be too hard since I'll just take the textures from the other buildings and modify them a bit to fit this one.

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 5:52 pm

Great. Just keep an eye on polycount, I got the feeling, even though this is an interior, it might be pretty hard on FPS.

Morden · Post by **Morden** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 5:56 pm

Why not re-texture the mushrooms and give them a creepy glow like the bittercoasts mushrooms? It would fit with the whole underground motif.

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 6:10 pm

Ah retexture. Never done that before. But then again. I am bad at texturing so why should I. Perhaps someone else can do the retexturing, it won't be much work (hint.. Morden 8) ).

I think we need a few larger Telvanni or AI mushrooms and a few smaller ones like the BC mushrooms. That would seems sufficient to me.

Majra · Post by **Majra** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 6:22 pm

dont worry, im a master of texturing, application that is, morden if you could be the actual texture maker that would be an awesome addition to the group

also, the cave interior statics, i could make those very very easily
Legolas a layout of the city would give me help in deciding what cave pieces need to be made

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 6:33 pm

I know you could, it is very easy and I have full confidence in you. Just make sure they fit on the grid and fit seamlessly. But I expect you already took those into consideration.

In addition, I was thinking about a Dialo-like quest construction (Diablo 1 that is). Getting your quests above ground from some people, and chopping and slashing your way down to finish the quests after which you get back up to get a reward and, if wanted, the next quest.
Perhaps we could even add an equivalent of the Town Portal Scroll (restricted to Dun Akafell of course). Of course we should not copy it, that's not what I'm suggesting (I doubt it is even possible making a Town Portal Scroll), just a similar way of getting up and down easily. However, Mark and Recall might already be enough to make this obsolete.

Morden · Post by **Morden** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 6:42 pm

Do you just want to use retextured AI mushrooms and retextured BC mushrooms? Or do you want to make your own? The BC mushrooms would look fine retextured, but the big ones would be extremely recognisable. I bet a skilled mesher could whip up a new big mushroom in no time. You could even just go into 3ds Max and make the BC mushroom models bigger.... that'd work fine.

Legolas55 · Post by **Legolas55** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 6:53 pm

Here's a picture of the model I've been working on. I don't know what to do to the roof so if you have any suggestions please tell me. More detail will be added. This is just the basic shape.

Majra · Post by **Majra** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:04 pm

legolas, i know you said it is still the basic shape, but if you look to architecture, especially indoril style, the mesh components are based on the texture... trims are completely different objects and shaped in a way to make texturing easy, I would suggest opening a mournhold or underground old mounrhold building in the TESCS then opening up max, and correlating between the two in how they used textures, also, id suggest you get the NIF importer for max, that will show you exactly how BS made their buildings and will really help in developing meshes in a game format, if you can replicate an indoril structure i would say you have become proficient with max, cause its the most complicated of the BS architectures in my mind

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:05 pm

I would like to see the buildings in the style of the 'temple ruins' below Mournhold. Check out the object In_OM_temple_ruins to see what I mean. If we go in that direction, your mesh would just need a roof like it is now, perhaps with statues on it for decoration and some decoration around the top of the pitched part to make the transition from pitch to flat look better.

The dark brotherhood meshes however have a complete different look. Since your mesh looks somewhat like those, we might be choosing that style and than it would just need an edge so you can walk on it (like Hlaalu buildings).

Legolas55 · Post by **Legolas55** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:17 pm

Well, this is 3dsmax 6, and for some reason the importer doesn't work. I have been using the next best thing that I think is helpful, looking at models in the TESCS in wireframe, I just don't know how to get the perspective view in wireframe. You're right saying the mesh is based on the texture. I'll try to compare this with Old Mournhold buildings and try to make it fit the textures well.

More trimming around the edges will be added as well.

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:20 pm

Ex- and importer both don't work in Max 6. It's very annoying.

I think you'll be able to mesh buildings in Max this way as well. Just look at the original buildings very good.

Majra · Post by **Majra** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:30 pm

question, Dun akafell is in the style of Old Mournhold right? like the temple ruin style? cause I think thats one arch style that wasnt seen enough in tribunal, and id like to expand on that one piece to make a bunch of cave pieces like that

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:33 pm

Then the buidlings have to be in that syle as well. I agree with the idea. I think it looks great and would make for a great underground view if you would find such a city.

Majra · Post by **Majra** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:46 pm

ok, concept question, about how big do you think
a) we are allowed to make this old city
b) how big we should make it
lets put it into common units of the mesh OM_temple ruin, which seems to be about 2 exterior buildings in size

in my opinion there should be a main balcony entranc into the old grand plaza(or whatever it should be called) where the very large cave pieces i will make can be used and it will have various run down buildings maybe with stalactites goin through their roofs

then coming out of this plaza would be some different sectors divided by a small hole between boulders in a way that the hole acts as a door to reduce FPS

And then maybe one of these holes will lead to a fairly large area where the old council building was?

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:56 pm

Each sector will be quite big then, larger than just one plaza, also some streets and things like that. I find it hard to imagine how big it should all be, but I estimate (really a rough estimation) about 2x2 or 3x2 the OM_temple_ruins static for the large parts of interior. (only in surface-size)

For the smaller parts 1x2 or even 1x1 of that size will do I think. But those will be really collapsed and use a lot of halls and such.

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 10:11 pm

I am planning on writing a book about Dun Akafell. It will start with a rough description of what is known about the place, where it is and it's history. After that I will add some accounts of adventurers and heroes who have entered the place.

For this, however, I need to know if it is mentioned in lore. Is the place made up, or are there some references in lore to the place. If there are I would like to know. If not, we have to come up with a history and explanation why it is there. Once that is all done, I'll write the book.

Majra · Post by **Majra** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 10:20 pm

so i am confused, was this an old dwemer city, or an old dunmeri? cause if it was old dunmeri, maybe your book could be in dunmeri, since common tongue would not have been very popular then, and it could be part of the cave area itself, maybe an old library with rare ancient books

prometheus · Post by **prometheus** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 10:25 pm

I would like to see the buildings in the style of the 'temple ruins' below Mournhold. Check out the object In_OM_temple_ruins to see what I mean. If we go in that direction, your mesh would just need a roof like it is now, perhaps with statues on it for decoration and some decoration around the top of the pitched part to make the transition from pitch to flat look better.

The dark brotherhood meshes however have a complete different look. Since your mesh looks somewhat like those, we might

i merged the both styles together in the Dun Akafell exterior ruins...so i planned them to be one for the rich part the other for the house livings and common quarters....

there are great textures there that if used well can lead to make u have new fantastic models....

for the quest i would suggest to begin like this...of course only a suggestion...it is up to u

the night falls near the path that leads to dragonglade...the pc founds himself victim of some unknown enemies that seem that canÃ‚Â´t be beaten ...he has to run away ...finally spots the inn where those enemies canÃ‚Â´t arrive becouse of the peculiar shape of it ...the dragon nest inn...here he can find some rest and finally discover about some dark curse that is roaming around the ruins and the surrounding woods...he could decide then to wait for the day and so evitate all the dangers of the night to prosecute to dragonglade or instead help the commoners there to get rid of this curse and discover ancient treasures and the legend of the Dark Dragon city...

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 10:38 pm

Majra: My book would just be a common book about the site, for the sole purpose of informing people about it.
I like the idea of a book (or several books) in dunmeri though - it would be found within the site written in the time the site was still a city.
And as I understand it is an old dunmer city, since we are discussing which style of meshes to use and both are dunmer-like and anything but dwemer.

Prom: I like the idea, except the enemies that can't be defeated. I'd prefer creatures from the tomb that have some sort of link with the Dragon Inn or Dun Akafell. If it were to be they are invincible and the PC runs the wrong way, he'll be running for the rest of his life.

prometheus · Post by **prometheus** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 10:46 pm

yes u are right ... but i intended some sort of scaled in power enemies ...so that the pc could face a foe that is on his same level....at least ....but dunno... would be cool to have a rain storm happen when night and the pc approaches the site...

prometheus · Post by **prometheus** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 10:48 pm

that could be intended for a local quest ... but even we could add another secret place that is accessible only following a bigger quests that could develope in different cities and places and have his final stage right there....

Vegor · Post by **Vegor** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 10:49 pm

Powerful enemies I agree. There should be a way to make the foes a real challenge, yet beatable and they should make the player ask himself where they came from. How we should make the link I'm unsure. Probably something on their corpses, or perhaps a journal entry asking where the creatures came from and that he should ask around. Upon asking anyone from around there he gets to hear about some site somewhere out there and gets directions to the Dragon Nest Inn.

Silvone Elestahr · Post by **Silvone Elestahr** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 10:51 pm

A sort of Traveller's Guide

Dun Akafell, the wonder, and danger, of (Group Map 2). Any traveller would go miles out of their way to avoid crossing paths with this mysterious ruin. Adventurers who have not yet braved the danger, or who have just come running from it, stay at the Dragons Nest Inn, just south of the ruin. The inn itself is barely safe from the danger, forced to take its residence high in the trees.

It is said that the dangers only lurk around at night, hunting any who dare come near. But most are more than willing to avoid the area completely, no matter what time of day.

Here is what one adventurer, (Silvone Elestahr

?), had to say about his brief run-in with the ruin:
"I had only two companions with me. We had not heard much of the place, only that it does not attract tourism, and that we should stay away during the night. Well, we were a bit cocky; having just been accepted into the ranks of the Imperial Legion, we wanted to bring something back to show them that they weren't wasting their time on us.
"we stayed at the Dragons Nest Inn to prepare for our adventure. We ate a small lunch, then left at dark. The inn keeper tried to warn us, but I only patted my sword. In all truth, my heart was pounding. But I wasn't about to show my companions any sign of fear.
We had not made it halfway to Dun Akafell before we were being hunted. The first to die was (Dagaon Urik ?), my closest friend. A dark figure came out of nowhere and jumped right onto him, tearing his flesh out. His screams did not last long. (Imstad Yalvua ?) and I ran back towards the inn, screaming for help! (Imstad) fell, I did not stop to try to save him. I just kept running. Somehow I ended up at Dun Akafell. I dont know how I got turned around, or where, or when. But there I was.
I made it to the highest spot I could find, and waited for light. I dont know how I made it through the night without being attacked."

(Silvone Elestahr )survived the encounter unharmed but for his mind. Many others are not so lucky. If any are daring enough to attempt this adventure, you might want to start out with an army.

All names made up by me, not permanent (nor is the story). The ending sucks, I know. But I didn't want it to take all day to do, so I ended it quickly. I can change it to make it more interesting if I make it into a book.
So, what say you? Tougher creatures? more creatures? More deaths? More suspence? What say you?